Episode Transcript
[00:00:03] Hey guys, we are live today with Heather head in the clouds and today I am by myself. I don't have Andres here today, but that's all he's. He's here in spirit. And today since I am by myself, what I thought we would do is something we kind of talked about before doing and I thought let's just go ahead and do it today. And that is am I the asshole Real Estate Edition.
[00:00:27] So we are actually live today and we are streaming on all of your favorite platforms. We are streaming on Facebook, Instagram, TikTok and YouTube today. So even though Andres isn't here, we are still streaming on his channels. Go ahead and give us a like share and follow and let's actually let's try to get a lot of like shares and follows while he's gone so when he comes back we can surprise him.
[00:00:52] All right guys, so whether you're joining us on TikTok or whether you're joining us through our stream, let's kind of dive into it. And today I think the way that we'll do this is I'm going to read the Reddit story and then I'm going to read some of the comments and then I'll dive in and give you my opinion and kind of dissect the story and tell you what I think from a Realtors point of view.
[00:01:14] So let's dive into the story.
[00:01:25] So am I the.
[00:01:27] Am I the for selling my house out from under my son and his girlfriend?
[00:01:39] I have a cough drop in my mouth, so sorry if I sound like I'm chewing on something, it's because I am.
[00:01:48] Okay.
[00:01:50] I, 60, female, have rented my second home to my son Joe, 34, male, for the last seven years.
[00:01:59] Initially he shared the home with friends at a below market rent, leases included agreements for periodic reasonable increases.
[00:02:17] Most of my retirement nest egg was in that home and I was clear that if there was ever any risk to the investment, I would have to sell immediately.
[00:02:31] Once I lost the homeowner's insurance as they were not proper properly maintaining the house, we made corrections and got it reinstated.
[00:02:41] Twice I lost my job and struggled to pay the mortgage and that house had my that and my primary residence. So sorry, I'll read that again. Twice I lost my job and struggled to pay the mortgage on that house and my primary residence, but was able to quickly find another job and cover expenses.
[00:03:05] Each of these instances prompted a conversation that they should prepare for the house to be sold if I could not resolve the problem.
[00:03:15] I planted the seed with my son that he should be saving money in case he wanted to buy the house someday.
[00:03:22] And this is where I might be. The asshole.
[00:03:26] He. He initially said he was not interested, but two years ago his girlfriend, 32, female, moved in and he showed more interest.
[00:03:37] I was very happy for them and I thought they were in a good relationship.
[00:03:42] They told their housemates they wanted to live together as a couple and asked them to move out.
[00:03:49] She coordinated an effort to clean up the house and maintain it better, which made me very happy.
[00:03:56] Then our neighborhood started changing.
[00:04:00] Investors were buying up properties at hugely inflated prices and mostly renting them out.
[00:04:07] Some homes are vacant for a long time before they're being rented.
[00:04:13] There was a shooting a block away.
[00:04:16] It was time to get out of that neighborhood and take advantage of of the higher market prices.
[00:04:22] I spoke to Joe and his girlfriend in the fall of 2023 and explained why they should start making plans to be out by the fall of 2024.
[00:04:34] We briefly discussed their financial situation.
[00:04:38] They were not able to buy the house and possibly never could. At the going rate, the value of the homes had more than doubled in a year and that market was not going to sustain itself much longer.
[00:04:54] Everything instantly changed.
[00:04:57] She was openly rude to my face via text. Oh, sorry. She was openly rude to my face and via text.
[00:05:04] When they moved out, they left some pretty vindictive messages around the house.
[00:05:11] They refused to give anyone in the family their new address.
[00:05:16] In 2017, I had promised Joe a portion of the profit when I sell.
[00:05:23] The day after I wrote him the check, he changed his phone number and has gone. No contact and broken my heart.
[00:05:32] His father, 71, male, my existence, told me that Joe eventually called him but still won't give his address.
[00:05:41] He told my ex if I ever got his phone number, he would just change it again and then never trust him.
[00:05:48] He said they are cutting me out of their lives because I sold the house out from under them.
[00:05:55] Follow up.
[00:05:57] They were mostly responsible tenants.
[00:06:00] Paid a fair price, always on time up, bit neglectful, but not destru destru destructive.
[00:06:08] The insurance companies were dicks. Not his fault, but my retirement fund was at risk.
[00:06:16] He is not spoiled at all, but we've always had a rocky relationship.
[00:06:21] I love him dearly and some of the comments are not totally fair to him.
[00:06:27] He could have lived with either parent for a low no cost.
[00:06:33] His siblings did this until they were on their feet.
[00:06:37] Joe chose to rent from me. The mortgage needed to be paid.
[00:06:42] I sold both houses, not just the rental and paid off the mortgages.
[00:06:48] So not a not A pure profit here.
[00:06:52] I owed money, we both had to move and and I'm downsizing to prepare for retirement.
[00:06:58] Cheaper houses in a cheaper area.
[00:07:02] Joe and his girlfriend are not in a position to buy a house even at a lower price. But if they were, why wouldn't they just turn around and sell for the extra cash?
[00:07:14] And that's where her portion of the story ends. And then we have some disagreement in the comment section. So I wanted to dive into those and let's see what everybody's thinking. So for those of you who are listening and follow along, following along, following along. I talk as well as I read care guys.
[00:07:34] If you want to drop in the comments, I'll try to get to them if I can and everybody can kind of weigh in their opinions and what you guys think. I already kind of have an idea. Although I do feel like there's a bunch of questions that aren't answered in here and I'll get to those when I go back at the end and kind of dissect the story.
[00:07:52] Let me start reading some of the comments here because there's a few comments and there's a lot of disagreement in here too.
[00:08:00] Oh it says OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole.
[00:08:07] I might be the asshole because I told my son consider saving his money to buy my house when I retire.
[00:08:17] So the first comment says not the asshole. You gave your son notice all along that this was not a long term solution. You talked with your son and his girlfriend and they could not afford to buy the house. You kept your word all throughout this, including writing them that check, which was which my petty behind would not have done.
[00:08:44] OP I am sorry you are hurting over the loss of your son and how he and his girlfriend are treating you. Sadly, your son was looking for you to continue how things were going and when it got hard for you, that wasn't the case.
[00:09:01] Son forgets that you could have sold the house when you lost your job earlier.
[00:09:06] What would he have done then? Probably treated you the same way.
[00:09:10] It sadly sounds like you will always be in your son and his girlfriend's villain in their story. I'm so sorry you were going through this.
[00:09:21] One of the comments to that says, I agree this may be a cynical point of view, but I think the girlfriend is masterminding the whole situation. She convinced the other roommates to move out, likely thinking she had it made.
[00:09:36] Subsidized housing and the possibility of a low purchase price. When that failed, she turned against you. Actually that I'm going to dive into it right now because actually that led to one of my questions as well earlier. If you go back into the story, it said that initially he shared the house with roommates at a below market rent, leases included agreements. So meaning like they were all paying rent. I don't know if she was charging by the room or if maybe she was renting to her son and then her son was like subletting rooms to other people. I have no idea how the financial arrangement was going, but what it sounds like is that his roommates were either paying rent to him or paying rent to her. There was more income coming in. And it doesn't say what that changed to when the girlfriend moved in because when the girlfriend moved in they basically wanted to play house because they wanted to live together as a couple and so the other roommates move out. So what happened to the money that was being paid by the other roommates? Did. Did mom just lose the money? Did they step up and pay more in rent?
[00:10:41] I don't know. That's. I kind of think a key factor in this story as to know if she's the or not. But from what it sounds like, I don't.
[00:10:51] It doesn't say that they covered the other rent that was lost. So I'm thinking that they probably didn't. But you know what they say about assumptions. Oops, let me not talk about my microphone here.
[00:11:02] So that was my question too. Was like it sound. It kind of sounds like the girlfriend thought that they were just gonna play house and be there for a while and then that's not what turned out happening. So.
[00:11:16] And again, don't know the whole story, but that was one of my questions. So let's keep going because there's quite a bit of disagreement in the comment section.
[00:11:28] This one says not the.
[00:11:30] They sound very ungrateful. You subsidized your son for years with below market value rent.
[00:11:37] Sounds like he and his girlfriend were hoping that that would go on indefinitely.
[00:11:42] Maybe get the word to him that he should be concerned about your will.
[00:11:51] Well, I mean both the houses are already gone. She said she was downsizing, so I don't think he expects to inherit a lot. But I get what you're saying there.
[00:12:04] This one just says, nope, cannot contact a son who won't give out his number. I change my will.
[00:12:10] So there's a lot of people just like ready to write off the sun.
[00:12:15] Not the. Okay, I know I said this comment section was disagreeing and all of these say not the but I promise you they're here. Not the one. You hinted that you might sell the house more than once.
[00:12:26] Two, you gave them the right of first refusal before putting it on the market.
[00:12:32] Three, you tried sending them a portion of the profit from the cell and then they moved away and ghosted you OP didn't sell the house out from under them.
[00:12:45] And then this is just somebody commenting saying that he took the check, then went no contact.
[00:12:51] Which is what her story says. He did take the check and then he went no contact.
[00:12:56] Sounds like your son was spoiled and thought he was entitled to your home. I think girlfriend played a big role in your son being no contact.
[00:13:07] Okay, this one says you said that if there was ever a risk or you were not able to resolve the problem, you'd sell. Did that occur?
[00:13:20] Question mark. Like capital question mark?
[00:13:24] It sounds like it didn't. It sounds like the neighborhood was being bought up at hugely inflated prices. So you decided to sell for profit, not due to problems. When you offered your son the ability to purchase before you sold, did you expect him to buy at a hugely inflated price?
[00:13:44] Capital question mark.
[00:13:47] Home purchases are down right now due to high prices and high interest rates. Housing is a challenge for people and you took a stable situation away because you wanted to maximize profit.
[00:14:03] Yeah, I'd be upset too. You had the right to do it, but that doesn't mean he isn't allowed strong feelings about it.
[00:14:12] Giving a portion of the profit was kind, but it's going to be spent on inflated rent prices and they'll likely rent for life.
[00:14:23] You weren't facing hardships and you had previously said you'd sell if there were problems. The girlfriend was maintaining the house.
[00:14:32] It sounds like you saw dollar signs and sold.
[00:14:37] That feels scummy.
[00:14:39] I won't say you're the asshole because you had the right, but I also understand the hurt and the upset feelings in response.
[00:14:51] So this is our first one that we've come across. Now that. And they're not saying she's the quote unquote asshole, but they're saying that they understand the hurt feelings and they see it from the sun's point of view.
[00:15:04] What are you guys thinking so far? Are we agreeing that she's the for selling it out from under her son or is she not the because she had the right to do it? I didn't.
[00:15:15] I'm not gonna jump into what I think yet. Let's keep reading and let's see.
[00:15:19] Well, I actually already did. I kind of told you. But I'm not gonna jump in anymore. Actually, that's a lie. I probably will if I read something that I want to comment on. Whatever. It's my show. I'll do what I want.
[00:15:28] Well, not only my show. It's Andres show too. But he's not here today.
[00:15:37] Where am I going? Oh, this one says it's crazy. I had to scroll this far down to see OP Isn't quite an was absolutely within their rights to sell, but it really does leave their kid in an absolute tight spot.
[00:15:58] This is your second home, OP you sold your second. And they're capitalizing the word second home that is apparently so high in value, your son and his girlfriend had no chance of buying it from you.
[00:16:13] When you pass, will your son get your money? Okay, hold on for first. First of all, like, okay, I'm jumping in. Like I said I wouldn't.
[00:16:21] He's 34. He's an adult. Okay, he's 34. How old is this girlfriend? 32. His girlfriend's 32.
[00:16:30] So go back down here where they're talking about, you know, helping. I'm all about setting your kids up for success, helping your kids. We have six kids, so believe me, I know what it takes to, like, make sure your kids are okay, make sure they're set up.
[00:16:48] But there comes a point when your kids do have to maintain their own life. Like, what if mom didn't have a second house? Where would they be if she didn't have that home? And this home was always meant to be her retirement. She says that up here, that it was meant to be her retirement was in that house.
[00:17:04] And there's a part in here where it says that the neighborhood is changing. There was a shooting, and nobody ever. I mean, there's tons of people will say they can tell what the market's going to do. And the market's going to do this. The market. You don't know what the market's going to do. The market is going to do what the market's going to do. You only know what the market is right now. And in the market they had right now, she said he wasn't going to be able to buy the house or any house, I guess. So my question would be if he'd been living there for seven years.
[00:17:33] Yes, because she said for the last seven years, he shared the home with friends, and then he's. The girlfriend moved in and they were both living there and they were paying below market value. If they were paying below market value, they should have been saving up maybe not necessarily to buy that house, but to buy a house that's in their means. I don't know what kind of house this is. I don't know how big it is. I don't know how many bedrooms it might be beyond what they can afford.
[00:17:58] But if they would have been saving, they should have had enough money to at least get them something within their means for the last seven years. That would be the whole point of living there at a below market rate.
[00:18:11] Now, when everybody moved out. That's my question. When they had the roommates that were there paying when everybody moved out, did they then take on more financial burden in that place? And was that more of a burden than they could afford? Because if it was, they should have kept the damn roommates and saved money.
[00:18:26] Because it seems like mom offered them a position where they were in a spot to gear up and get ready for their future, and now they seems like they wasted it and they got mad. To me, it kind of seems like they just thought they were going to live there forever and then maybe she would just give them the house. But it doesn't seem like that was ever the plan. And she even gave them a year, she said. I spoke with Joe and his girlfriend in the fall of 2023 and explained why they should start making plans to be out by the fall of 2024. That's a year. She's giving them a year.
[00:18:59] That's a lot more. If you're renting and your landlord's going to sell the house, that's a lot more notice than a lot of people get. So that's a year for them to figure out what they're going to do.
[00:19:11] I don't know. So far, I'm. I'm leaning towards. She's not the.
[00:19:17] Let's keep reading and see what other people are saying.
[00:19:23] Okay, here's one that agrees that she is the.
[00:19:26] It says, thank you.
[00:19:28] That's actually it. And I can't believe more people aren't seeing this. She didn't sell because of hardship. She saw a way to make a massive profit and offered them the house at an inflated price.
[00:19:42] Her words that the market was inflated.
[00:19:46] Even mentioning that she rented the house to him as below market value. Okay, so instead of stealing from your son with the inflated housing market value, you rented it to him at a fair price.
[00:20:01] That's your child. Why would you rent to them to pay off your mortgage at an inflated rate?
[00:20:09] Agree. She had every right to sell.
[00:20:12] But let's look at the missing pieces here. She's a greedy boomer that took a fat check. Good for her.
[00:20:20] But don't expect your son and his girlfriend that she admits put a bunch of work into the house to be in your life.
[00:20:30] Hope the check was worth it. I guess so. Now she's a greedy boomer.
[00:20:37] Okay, did she put, let's see what it says. Did she put a bunch of work into the house?
[00:20:42] She coordinated an effort to clean up the house and maintain it better.
[00:20:47] That doesn't. That's not putting work into the house, dear. She coordinated an effort to clean up the house. So clean up the mess that she's making. Like they're living there.
[00:20:59] That kind of makes me think that. And she even said before they weren't maintaining the house. So the girlfriend wasn't a slob.
[00:21:05] Clean the house and maintained it better.
[00:21:09] Doesn't say she. They didn't remodel the kitchen. They weren't outside, you know, taking care of the landscaping, putting in bushes or not putting in bushes, like sodding the yard, things like that. They weren't, they weren't making improvements to the home. It seems like they were probably doing the bare minimum of maintaining it and keeping it clean, but it doesn't seem like they were improving the home.
[00:21:33] Now that's my spot. So let me get back down to work. All right, here we go.
[00:21:42] And if I go back up it actually, so her point to here is, you even mentioned she rented the house home a below market value. Okay? So instead of stealing from your son with the inflating housing market, okay, even if she charged him fair market value for a house, that if she has a second house, she's renting it to him. Even if she's running it to him at market value, that's still probably better than he would get anywhere else because his mom's his landlord. So it's not like if there's a problem, he's like, actually right now, I know some renters who don't have an air conditioner and the people they're renting from aren't really doing the best job to get it. The situation straightened out. So. So I bet if he called mommy and said something isn't working in the house, she's going to fix it. And there's no reason why she should take a loss on the house just because it's her son.
[00:22:36] It doesn't seem like she has the money to just float both homes from what she's saying.
[00:22:46] Let's see.
[00:22:47] Okay, so here's a comment. It says for seven years, her financial well being was neglect, neglected and affected because she was subsidizing her Adult son. She clearly stated that it. Is that it?
[00:23:03] I can't talk. She clearly stated that it's her retirement nest egg. She could have been renting to a third party at Market Rent and she would not have struggled so much when she lost her job.
[00:23:17] In other words, she made sacrifices to help out her son. Instead of using the time wisely to put. This is what I said, to put some saved rent into savings account for his future, he developed a sense of entitlement that his mother would always be subsidizing him to her own detriment.
[00:23:38] The money she gave him from the house sale was on top of the money she effectively gifted gifted him for seven years by denying herself rent money. She sold because the neighborhood was going downhill and if she hadn't, she could have ended up losing money.
[00:23:55] The greedy one here was not the op.
[00:23:59] And I am gobsmacked that anyone could side with the sun.
[00:24:04] So I guess my question would be to you, if the neighborhood went down, not, not to her, just to like the son or whoever, whoever's siding with the sun.
[00:24:13] Let's say she didn't sell and the son and the girlfriend lived there, what would happen if she didn't sell? When the. The investors were coming in, the neighborhood went downhill and they move out, they decide they just want to move out, they don't want to live there anymore. You know, something happens, the girlfriend wants to go live with her family, they get a job, they move away, whatever, what have you, they move out of the house, which is there, right? As renters, they're not tied there. They can leave the house.
[00:24:42] What happens to mom? She is left holding a bag. She didn't sell when she could have. And this was her, this was her retirement plan. She has to find other renters, get those other renters in there. And renting's hard. Renting is not an easy thing because you have to make sure. I always tell our investor clients that are purchasing a rental home to rent out to renters, that if they're not paying cash for that house, if they've taken a loan out for that house, you have to be able to swing both of those payments. You have to make sure that you can handle your own mortgage payment and the payment of this rental house as well. Because what happens if you can't get a renter in there? Or worse, you get a renter in there and then they decide they're not going to pay rent, Then you have to start the eviction process. But in the meantime, that mortgage still has to be Paid.
[00:25:27] So I don't think that mom should have been left holding the bag on that, because at any point, the son and the girlfriend could be like, deuces, I'm out of here. And then the mom is stuck with a house that is all of her money stuck into, and she doesn't have an immediate plan.
[00:25:45] So I don't know, let's see what else people are saying.
[00:25:53] And yet the son was paying below market rent for seven years. He had ample time to save the difference as a deposit for buying a home, either OP or someone else's. Seems you also missed the part where the neighborhood was deteriorating, which is a risk to OP's investment, as it's a problem she couldn't resolve. It's therefore fits the criteria. That's true. That's true. She did say if her money. If her retirement money became at risk, she. She was gonna sell.
[00:26:25] Lots of people get really pissy when the gravy train they're taking for granted disappears. OP sun is clearly one such.
[00:26:36] So I. I agree with the earlier comment. I don't know that the girlfriend's like the evil villain of the story or the mastermind behind everything.
[00:26:45] It seems like the son was already, you know, I don't want to say he was taking advantage of the mom, because if. If the mom's like, yes, you can live there for this price. This is the price they agreed on. That's not him really taking advantage of her until he started to not put away money and not go forth with the plan of, like, saving up and someday supporting himself. But then it seems like, you know, the girlfriend did move in. They had the plan of, we're just gonna live here. And then when they couldn't buy it, and it's like, okay, now, you know, we're gonna leave. I'm never gonna talk to you again.
[00:27:16] I think if the girlfriend wasn't in the picture, I don't think he would have gone. No contact. I definitely think that the two of them together, but the girlfriend is not the end all, be all. The son can make his own choices, and he's choosing to go. No contact. That's his choice.
[00:27:31] So I don't think it's really fair to put that on her and be like, oh, the girlfriend's a mastermind behind it. You know what? He's a big boy. He needs to put on his big boy panties. And he was contacting his mom enough to take that check from her. I wish it said how much the check was. I bet you what they didn't do with that check? I bet you they didn't put it into a down payment on a house.
[00:27:56] See, I was hoping there would be a follow up, but I don't. I don't see one. I've been scrolling way down to see if she posted anything else about it.
[00:28:05] Let's see.
[00:28:22] Okay, here we are. She. She commented here. Okay, so somebody said info. You said the girlfriend coordinated the effort to get bad roommates out of the house. I don't know that I said they were bad, but whatever. Clean up and maintain it. How much money slash labor did your son and the girlfriend put into the house? I'm assuming the cleaning and maintenance. Maintenance Raise the property value. Okay, here we go. That's. This is the answer. What we talked about earlier.
[00:28:50] And mostly sad. That's her username. Said it would be hard to quantify. Probably more labor than money. I was not happy with some of their changes, which they should have gotten approval for in advance according to our lease.
[00:29:09] Okay, so they went ahead and made some changes that she wasn't happy with.
[00:29:16] And then this says we can only do our best with them.
[00:29:23] Impart as much wisdom as we can. Try to teach them life skills. But we can't make it stick. They ultimately choose what they want to be. You subsidize his living expenses for a long time and. And he ate the cost when he messed up. And still your efforts weren't good enough for him. He thinks you owe him more. And she is in his ear. I guess somehow she thinks you owe her too.
[00:29:50] Sorry, Op. I know the weight of your sadness is probably unbearable at times, but you didn't do anything wrong. Their expectations were more than you were capable of meeting. I. That they didn't offer to supplement your retirement for you to be able to afford selling to them below market value they expected but were not owed.
[00:30:13] Maybe he'll find out that she isn't the great catch he thought she was.
[00:30:18] And he will need you again.
[00:30:22] Or life will happen. They'll get in a bind and they'll both be at your door. Good luck, Op. I wish you the best.
[00:30:36] I do think part of the blame falls on her a little bit. I don't think she necessarily set him up for adulthood in the sense of being responsible, making his own choices. It kind of seems like.
[00:30:50] It kind of seems like she was always there to rock a better phrase. Wipe his ass. And. And then one day when she's like, I'm just not gonna wipe your ass anymore.
[00:30:59] He didn't really know how to handle it.
[00:31:02] I'M not gonna name names, but there was a adult male that was a close family member in my life in the past and he was pretty much just given a house.
[00:31:16] Everything was paid for and the hope was always that if they just kept doing for him, doing for him, doing for him, doing for him, eventually he would grow up and make something out of his life. And unfortunately that never happened.
[00:31:30] And he was a grown man that couldn't do anything. Everything had to be done for him. And then when people passed away that he relied on, it was a reality check to him because he didn't know how to do anything. He didn't know how to do anything for himself. And it kind of seems like this is how she set him up a little bit. I don't think she was to that extreme, but it does seem like he does have the attitude of just I'm, I'm owed it.
[00:31:59] Okay? OP responded and said I totally recognize my privilege.
[00:32:05] It came through significant emotional pain. I wouldn't wish this on any other human. I still need to prepare for my own elder years and not favor one child over the others. I just don't have that many houses to give away. I would prefer to care for myself and not be a burden on my children.
[00:32:26] And that's the other thing too is like why would he get the whole house?
[00:32:31] Why would he get more than any of the other kids get?
[00:32:37] Dude was living at a submarket rent. Did he save many? And I mean many did not have the chance he and his girlfriend had.
[00:32:47] I wish I had that chance to knowing my parents would still have a good retirement. Her son is so entitled and some of these comments here saying that yes, Okie betrayed her son for making money make me laugh. People have it so easy these days that they feel like they should be getting more free money and houses. He had years to save while paying sub market rent.
[00:33:13] They had years to plan their next move.
[00:33:16] They had years to discuss openly with his mother, long term plans, etc.
[00:33:21] OP if you read this cut this kid out of your life. Some people are too entitled to your for your own good, enjoy your well deserved money and try to have some Fun while healing. P.S. we had to cut off one of our siblings out of our lives for that very reason.
[00:33:39] It was damaging the whole family, especially my mom. They know their power they might have on their parents and playing on their emotions. Don't fall for it. And then the next comment just says rewrite your will. Years of doing him a favor and they treat you like this.
[00:33:58] The next comment says they are ungrateful brats. They just assumed you were going to give them the house eventually. You did what you had to do and it's okay.
[00:34:09] If that's what it took for your brat of a kid to go no contact, I say good riddance. They are just mad that they can't take advantage of you anymore.
[00:34:20] This one says you're the asshole. You act like you had no choice but to sell it at a high price after dangling it in front of your son like a carrot for years.
[00:34:33] OP says what was the better choice? Let him buy it. And then he might lose the investment if the area continues to decline.
[00:34:44] Play favorites with him and not his siblings.
[00:34:48] Owing two houses does. Oh, owning. Sorry, Owning two houses doesn't mean I'm a wealthy woman.
[00:34:56] His rent paid a mortgage. I couldn't offer a deal like that to all my children.
[00:35:03] Yeah, I'm not understanding people who are not understanding that. He's not her only kid.
[00:35:08] She can't buy a house. She's not in the position to buy a house for all of her kids. She said that multiple times. If she was in a position to buy a house for all of her kids, there wouldn't be an issue. But yes. She can't just be like, here, take this house. That was supposed to be my retirement plan.
[00:35:25] This one just says not the. An excellent example of why you never do business with family or friends. This isn't really doing business. They didn't like, join a businessman. I get what she's saying, but this wasn't like a joint business venture. This was a rental property that she bought and he had housemates.
[00:35:44] Okay, so let. Oh, I saw something really quick and then we're gonna.
[00:35:58] So here's my thing with you sucking Op and it might change if you clarify some questions. Okay, this one sounds like a good one to read.
[00:36:07] So it sounds like you bought two houses, were barely able to cover the costs, but manage to get through. Right?
[00:36:16] And now you're going to sell one house before the market bus. Correct.
[00:36:22] So you're most likely going to make insane profits off a house due to market fluctuations and a huge inflation whilst while selling it in a neighborhood you know is going to go down the toilet.
[00:36:39] You didn't offer it to your son at a reduced price knowing that A, he couldn't afford it. And two RB Sorry. And B, the neighborhood is going downhill and the house will be losing value. Correct.
[00:36:55] So you want your son or someone else to buy a drop in investment.
[00:37:03] Did you offer your son a good.
[00:37:07] Well below market cost of rent or or did you keep it at market value, which I assume is yes from your description of rent increases.
[00:37:17] So to me it does seem like you care more about money than your son. It seems.
[00:37:24] Oh, it seems you leeched off him for rent for years, then attempted to sell it to him at an inflated price for future value without even offers of helping him achieve such price, co signing rent to own, etc.
[00:37:46] This is all conjecture and absolutely would change pending clarification.
[00:37:51] This is all fine of you to do, but it's 100 GS about the money over your son which he has a right to be upset about.
[00:38:03] He is the asshole because at the end of the day you gave him tons of warning and it is after all your house.
[00:38:10] While I understand him being upset, NC is pretty extreme.
[00:38:17] No contact is pretty extreme for the situation and you didn't sell out and you didn't sell it out from under them ESH and op.
[00:38:30] You should either clarify or be more honest about yourself.
[00:38:37] Okay, here's what she says As a single mom of three, I bought a house after selling a marital home. After divorce we are talking normal little starter homes.
[00:38:56] After many years I remarried.
[00:38:59] My son was still living with me but did not want to live with me and my new husband although we told him he was welcome.
[00:39:10] I do understand how hard it is for young people in this market and many in their generation need support.
[00:39:17] I don't judge him for this at all. I was getting ready to sell the house and he asked if some of his friends could move in and pay enough rent to cover my mortgage. Oh, that would have been a great detail to have earlier.
[00:39:31] My husband and I bought another house but he passed away suddenly in 2021 and I became a one income household.
[00:39:42] I had to take extended leave after the trauma and and have not been the same since.
[00:39:49] That is when I lost my job twice.
[00:39:52] I now have a stable job and much lower pay.
[00:40:00] Well, this is a different poster. First off, I'm very sorry for your loss and the difficulties that befell you. It didn't really clarify anything other than the job situation though.
[00:40:12] Were you charging market rent to your son? How long ago did you buy the house? Also, having three children brings up additional question. How do your other children channel this matter? Okay, actually it did kind of clarify some stuff for me, but I'm going to read her comment and then we'll talk about it. So she said I charged him enough to cover my mortgage only for that house he split with friends so I assume his share wasn't more than 5 to 600amonth.
[00:40:38] I bought it in 2012 and remarried in 2017, buying the second house with my husband. The property had risen slightly in market value, but nothing like what happened in 2022 and 2023. My other children know my assets and are intended to be split equally between them all. Joe would have to sell and split the money or buy them out if he wanted to stay.
[00:41:10] Let's see.
[00:41:19] Oops. Okay, so basically that she.
[00:41:24] He. It was his idea. He wanted to move in and he wanted to move in with friends.
[00:41:31] Let me get back up to where I was.
[00:41:37] Lost my spot, ready to go.
[00:41:48] Okay, now I totally lost my spot of where we were reading, but basically from what I just read, he wanted to move in. So he moved in and he moved in with friends.
[00:42:13] Okay, here we go.
[00:42:15] As a single mom of three, I bought a house after selling a marital home after divorce.
[00:42:20] We are talking normal little starter homes. After many years, I remarried and my son was still living with me. So he was still living with her, this one son, but didn't want to live with me and my new husband, although we told him he was welcome.
[00:42:36] So I think early in her other story she talked about that the other kids could live with them at low or no cost. So he could have stayed with her is what she's basically saying. He could have lived there with her at that point and not paid rent, because it doesn't. She doesn't say he's paying rent now, so I'm assuming he's probably not or way less than he was.
[00:43:00] I was getting ready to sell the house and he asked if some of the friends can move in. Okay, so she bought a house after her divorce and then she got remarried to her husband, not like remarried to her new husband and they bought a marital house. So she has her post divorce house and now she has her remarital house and she was getting ready to sell it. So the house that Joe's been in for seven years, she was going to sell when she got married.
[00:43:28] I was getting ready to sell the house and he asked if some of his friends could move in and pay enough rent to cover my mortgage.
[00:43:37] My husband and I bought another house, but he passed away suddenly. Okay, so she's getting ready to sell the house and he says, can me and my friends move in and we'll pay in rent to cover your mortgage?
[00:43:49] So whatever. She could have got market value, she didn't because she only charged him enough to cover the mortgage. And it doesn't even seem like that's the price that she said. That seems like what he said that they would do. And she agreed to it. Obviously she was like okay, yeah. So basically and for the person earlier who was like mooching your mortgage payment off of him, that's not mooching your mortgage payment off of him. This was his idea. He wanted to move in. He's not paying extra rent, he's just paying the rent to cover the mortgage payment. If he was renting somewhere else, he would be paying somebody else's mortgage payment too.
[00:44:30] Let's see.
[00:44:33] But he suddenly passed away in 2021 and I became a one income household and had to take extended leave. So her husband dies. 2021, her husband dies, which obviously trauma from that. She's very sad because she just got remarried, thought this was her person that she was going to be with, you know, for the rest of her life and then he passes away. Suddenly she starts to have income. TR yeah. So I'm wondering like when all of this happened.
[00:45:15] Her husband has his away, they've got the two houses he moves in. Obviously years pass, his roommates are there. So that's still. I'm still looking to see if it doesn't answer the question of whether or not they paid for the roommates expense like the roommate share of the rent.
[00:45:47] Okay, info.
[00:45:50] If you had been talking to them about actually selling the house, why do they believe you sold the house from under them? Your wording isn't concrete in mentioning hints and saying they should make plans. But were you upfront with them in the fall of 2023 and actually said you were selling the house by fall of 2024? Did you give them a timeline or was it up in the air? If you were actually upfront about it, then it's massively influences my judgment.
[00:46:21] A P says I think I was very direct, but I am aware that it's subjective and frankly we all know that sometimes our kids tune us out. So perhaps he only heard what he wanted. He knows I cannot favor him by giving him a house when I could never do the same for his siblings. I also don't think buying that house from me at any price would be a good investment for him. He he might not get his investment back and the neighborhood is not pleasant to live in.
[00:46:52] I agree with an earlier poster that his alternative may not have been much better.
[00:46:59] I had suggested I could reinvest the profit in a different house more in their price range and give them more time to buy it, but they were just too angry. I think yeah, kind of sounds like he was hoping you'd never go through with it.
[00:47:21] He sounds very ungrateful considering what you've done for him.
[00:47:27] Let's see.
[00:47:29] This one says you're the asshole. You pick profit over family. And not only that, you continued to.
[00:47:35] You contributed to the housing crisis situation by selling to an investor. An investor who is, no doubt in the process of gentrifying their neighborhood.
[00:47:47] Okay.
[00:47:49] No one cuts off their parents lightly.
[00:47:52] There has to be more history to this relationship. That makes me so angry. Or that makes him so angry. Sorry. Makes him so angry. Everyone blames the girlfriend for the estrangement.
[00:48:04] I know with my husband, he didn't realize what a crap mom his mom is until he spent time with my family.
[00:48:12] His mom sees it as me causing a rift, but he just looked back and was pissed at how selfish she was.
[00:48:21] OP says we've always had a challenging relationship. It's true. I never figured out why.
[00:48:28] Similar to this situation, I've been very firm at times, but I also think fair. I certainly made mistakes, like all humans. I don't know what in our history would warrant this.
[00:48:43] I mean, also, it's probably what he's saying to the girlfriend too. I'm sure he's like, bitching about his mom to the girlfriend. So the girlfriend's gonna have a skewed version of the mom because of what he says.
[00:48:56] But the mom is right in this. She can't just give them the house. It seems like they want. They just want to be given the house. And she can't give them the house. Even. Even if she, like, wanted to, she couldn't. Because she can't afford to do that until she has other kids.
[00:49:11] So if they were just living there and the mom passed away, they would have to sell the house. They wouldn't just get to keep the house.
[00:49:20] So no way, shape or form was this ever going to be. They just get a free place to live.
[00:49:32] Not the asshole. But I think the son assumed you would just gift him the house someday. Perhaps the girlfriend put this notion in his head as his birthright or something.
[00:49:43] Not much you can do other than be there if he ever wants to reconcile.
[00:49:52] That is exactly it. Which is further complicated by the fact that Op has other children and sounds like could not financially play favorites like that.
[00:50:04] Okay, so we'll read this one and then we're going to wrap it up.
[00:50:08] Each of these instances prompted a conversation that they should prepare for the house to be sold if they couldn't resolve the problem. The entire conversation about selling if there was a problem is a red hearing, as this isn't why you did it. You didn't sell it out of need. You sold it because you saw the potential for a larger profit. He initially said he was not interested, but two years ago, his girlfriend, 32, female, moved in and showed more interest. I'm very happy for them and I thought he had a good relationship. All the stuff you said about the property being poorly maintained for a while is irrelevant because it wasn't in the condition at the time that it was sold.
[00:50:49] It's also immaterial that he was previously uninterested in purchasing it, as once his girlfriend moved in, he was interested. The value of the home had more than doubled in a year and the market was not going to sustain itself much longer.
[00:51:08] Not the asshole. You have the right to sell if you wanted.
[00:51:13] You had the right to sell if you want and take the profits. But he's a jury of one and your justifiable decision didn't sit well with him. You sold a property he was maintaining and interested in purchasing.
[00:51:28] The check you wrote him wasn't enough to buy him off, so you got your profits and you lost the relationship. Okay, so foreign, let's go back up here and read through this. Because one thing that I'm not seeing in this story at all is him and the girlfriend ever saying, hey mom, we talked to a lender and we're approved to buy the house. Or, hey mom, we talked to a lender and we're approved for this much money and your house is too much.
[00:52:02] I don't think from how she's explaining the story and all the comments that they read that they ever did anything, her, the girlfriend and the son ever did anything to try to proactively purchase this home. I don't think that was the plan.
[00:52:17] She never in here says, oh, you know, we sat down, we talked, we talked with an investor or not an investor, I'm sorry, we talked with a lender and this is what they qualify for. Or back in. When did she say, I spoke with Joe and his girlfriend in the fall of 2023 and explain why they should start making plans to be out by the fall.
[00:52:35] We briefly discussed their financial situation.
[00:52:37] They were not able to buy the house and possibly never could at the going rate.
[00:52:42] So how did they know that? Were they just like, we'll never be able to buy a house? Did they go talk to a lender? Did they find out that they have bad credit, don't have enough money, their debt to income's Too high. What's the deal? We don't know because it doesn't say. But they had a year. They had a year where they could have gone and worked with a lender and done whatever they needed to do to try to get to the point where they could buy the house. But it doesn't seem like that was ever done.
[00:53:10] And she says up here it wasn't being maintained properly.
[00:53:23] I lost the homeowner's insurance as they were not properly maintaining the house. We made corrections and got it reinstalled, dated. Okay. So again, she was going to sell the house.
[00:53:34] He said, let me and my friends move in and we'll pay enough rent to cover your mortgage payment. And then they did not maintain the house that lost the homeowner's insurance. She could have kicked him out at that point. She could have done an injection and kicked him out at that point, but she didn't. So he got to stay with his roommates.
[00:53:52] I lost my job and struggled to pay the mortgage on the house and my. And my primary residence, but was able to quickly find another job to cover expenses. So when she lost her job, her husband died. She was struggling, lost her job. Did the son ever say, hey, mom, why don't you just move in to this house with us? Why don't you sell that house? Move into, move in with this house with us? Bet you he didn't. She doesn't say that he did.
[00:54:24] Do I think she's the. No, I don't think she's the.
[00:54:28] I don't think she's the. For selling her house. I. I do think that she did not prepare her son for adulthood, because it doesn't seem like it now. I. I don't want to be like, oh, she's a terrible mom. I didn't prepare her son.
[00:54:44] Sometimes best life plans fail. You try your hardest, they turn out to be who they are.
[00:54:49] But it does seem like he seems very entitled. He doesn't feel like he should have to do anything. And the girlfriend kind of seems the same way. But she doesn't say that her other kids are. No contact. Her other kids are, you know, they're with her. And it doesn't seem like they're horribly upset, judging from the other comments.
[00:55:05] So I don't think she's this asshole for selling her house. I think she let him stay there far longer than he probably should have.
[00:55:14] And is he the asshole? I don't know. Is this the way his life's always been? If he's always been handed everything and he's never actually had to work. He's never actually had to live for himself, then he's not really the asshole either because he's just doing what she trained him to do. Now if that's not the case and he just all of a sudden feels entitled, then yeah, he's the asshole. So no, I don't think she is the asshole. I think she did the right thing. I think anybody in the comment section who's like, oh, you're just wanted the money. It was an investment property. At that point she was going to sell it. She had another house and she says, this is my retirement. This is my retirement fund. Her husband died. She's struggling financially. She has to think about her wife that's she's going to be leaving ahead. So no, I, I don't think she is the.
[00:56:06] So what do you guys think? Do you think she's the. Do you agree with some of the comments saying that she was all about getting that bag or do you think that, you know, she tried to help her son and then her son and the girlfriend took advantage?
[00:56:30] All right, guys, we are almost out of time. That went by like really fast too when we were reading all the comments and stuff. Well, I actually had a lot of fun reading this story.
[00:56:39] Hopefully we can have more segments like this where we do Am I the Asshole? Real Estate edition. I'm actually looking forward to Thursday.
[00:56:47] Andres will be back and we have some exciting stuff going on this week and next week. So we're really looking forward to that.
[00:56:55] But in the meantime, don't forget to go like subscribe and follow and hit us up on Real Talk Live. So Real Talkha Live so that you can subscribe and follow us. And if you are in the Alabama market and you're looking to purchase or sell a home, hit up Andres. And if you are in the Atlanta market, both of our calendars are linked so you can reach out to both of us.
[00:57:22] And until the next time, we will see you guys. Oh, and at one o' clock, if you come to our one o' clock live, we're going to be doing some more technology stuff. So that is really cool. I know Sean is really excited to talk about emails and some automations that are going to go. I think we're doing emails today and automations that are going on there. So make sure you jump on there and I will put up the scroll real quick so you guys can see it.
[00:57:49] Maybe it doesn't want to work. Come on.
[00:57:55] All right. Just kidding. I'm not going to because oh, wait. Yes, I am. Okay, there it goes. And that will be meet cloud realty.com one o'. Clock. Again, that is meet cloud realty dot com. So we will see you guys at one o' clock and I will talk to you guys on the next one.
